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Dianatomia (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Maybe a bird whispered it in your ear. There never was a Macedonian ethnic group. There were different ethnic groups in Macedonia, but not a Macedonian ethnic group.
VTEKEN (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Dinatomia,did you not hear the part where they mention the ethnic people of Macedonia.
They are the real Macedonians, the people who lost their identity through 100's of years occupation by Roman & Ottoman Empires.
The Greeks identity was made up in 1829 to weaken the Ottoman rule and for England & France to have a puppet in the Balkans aka Greece. Russia's puppet was Bulgaria in 1878.
Dianatomia (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Nationalism is indeed a modern creation, but Greeks, Armenians, Jews etc. had pre-existing cultural and linguistical elements akin to them that existed far before the 1800s. Through that they had a sense of identity or ethnos. They combined these elements with modern nationalism to create their new political states. But there was no Macedonian ethnos. The modern one (of FYROM) is entirely forged. It has no bulk like i.e. Greeks, Jews, Armenians etc.
Dianatomia (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
6:00, three french boys, one Greek, four Spainish Jews, A serb, an armenian, a Turk and a montenegrin.
Nationalism is a modern creation of the french revolution, but ethnos is not. There were Greeks, Jews, Armenians, Bulgarians etc. in the ottoman empire. They identified themselves primarily thourgh their church. i.e. Greek orthodox church or Armenian Orthodox church. In lesser extend through their language. However, there was not a Macedonian orthodox church or language or ethnos.
VTEKEN (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
Christina Kolouri. Part 1 5:00.
She clearly states that back then people didn't identify themselves by their nationalities. In the Balkans religion was what split the different people up. Not langauge, not Nationality.
There was no Greeks in Macedonia either, nor Bulgarians, nor Albanians, nor MAcedonians. The length of occupation had got rid of any national feeling. That doesn't mean the identity of the people wasn't different.
VTEKEN (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
pavlaki1969 - in Macedonia few described themselves as Macedonian, most people had no conception of what it meant to belong to a Macedonian nation.
Maybe because they were occupied for over a thousand years, constantly trying to anexed into it's independent neighbouring countries.
Greeks had no sense of nationality till the Western World created Greece to weaken the Ottomans. 1878. If Greeks were occupied and Macedonia was free, you'd have no nationality.
itrajkoski (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
but i thought northern greeks have been calling themselves macedonians for over 2,000 years...
nationalism is a very modern social occurence...
the 'greeks' and 'bulgarians' formed their nationalistic idealogies in the 1800s, while the still ottoman oppressed macedonians did so 50-100 years later...
itrajkoski (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
sure...by indegenous they meant albianian, turkish, or vlach right?
pavlaki1969 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
See 4:30 in part 2. It says "in Macedonia few described themselves as Macedonian, most people had no conception of what it meant to belong to a Macedonian nation". Tell us dear Paeonian Slav members, why is this?
qwertdfsf7 (November 30, 1999 at 12:00 am)
It says Indigenous armed GROUPS and not a group... |
